text:
How does metta sutra develop loving kindness
Metta sutra says "May all living beings be happy minded." This seems illogical to me as all living beings cannot be happy minded at a particular moment of time. I also feel that contemplating on anything that is false will not lead me to the ultimate truth. In my view loving kindness should be better cultivated by knowing the true nature of things because if we get insight into real nature of things then we will automatically develop kindness by clearly seeing dukkha and we would be able to understand the suffering of others in a better way. Note: I do not intend to offend great Buddhist scriptures. I asked this question to clear my ignorance.

When you understand the suffering of others, this would result in you developing your compassion (karuna) and not exactly loving kindness (metta). So, compassion is a bit different. Compassion is how one deals with others' suffering (dukkha) while renunciation is how one deals with one's own suffering. Of course, there may be some overlap between the two.
Then what about loving kindness (metta)? This term metta has also been translated as benevolence, friendliness, amity, good will and universal love.
You're perfectly right that all beings cannot be happy-minded at once.
Cultivating metta is about changing YOUR state of mind, and not actually changing other people's state of mind.
Loving kindness is about you changing your thoughts, emotions, intentions, attitude, outlook and conduct, in such a way that it radiates with benevolence and friendliness to all beings (including yourself). It is so that you become the true friend who wishes everyone, without discrimination, to be happy and at ease with themselves. Loving kindness is a cure for one's ill will towards others.
On the other hand, compassion is about you trying to understand the suffering of others and trying to alleviate the suffering of others, or at least not make it worse. Compassion is a cure for one's contempt for others.

By reading your answer I understand that the buddha taught metta sutra as a tool to develop loving kindness or friendliness towards all beings, and he did not want us to take the literal meaning.

That is, on a more focused view, right, householder Sriram Goutam P, and no offend of the Buddhas teachings at all but a wise observed encouragement.
- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -
While the development of metta certainly has not the purpose to change the world of others, or give oneself the task to feel such as love toward any being, it's used to develop an attitude of goodness and goodwill toward all, what ever might be the quality of relation. See "Mettā means Goodwill", which corrects certain wrong transmitted attributes of metta.
Giving others the wish "May these beings be free from animosity, free from oppression, free from trouble, and may they look after themselves with ease!"
Mostly such a honest wish, acting without harm, is all one could do for others and having done all what one can do gives release, freedom of debts.
There are less who actually do not give such a gift, also in action, but mostly only toward those regarded as own or regarded a heading after ones aims and desires.
Once the ensnared net of battle each other can be seen, that there is no real justification why siding snake or mouse, and that beings are heirs of their actions, i.e. right view arises, metta, the wish for the best for all can non-hypocritical developted toward all in the universe, good, wise and fools, gifted or worse. That is one huge different to the metta development of the Jains:

They get their disciple to undertake the following practice: 'Here, my good man. Lay down the rod with regard to beings who live more than 100 leagues to the east... more than 100 leagues to the west... more than 100 leagues to the north... more than 100 leagues to the south.' Thus they get the disciple to undertake kindness & sympathy to some beings, but not to others.
"On the Uposatha day, they get their disciple to undertake the following practice: 'Here, my good man. Having stripped off all your clothing, say this: "I am nothing by anything or of anything. Thus there is nothing by anything or of anything that is mine."'
Thus at a time when he should be persuaded to undertake truthfulness, he is persuaded to undertake falsehood. At the end of the night, he resumes the consumption of his belongings, even though they aren't given back to him. This counts as stealing, I tell you. Such is the Uposatha of the Jains, Visakha. When this Uposatha of the Jains is undertaken, it is not of great fruit or great benefit, not of great glory or great radiance.

And there is the strategical giving of metta of the cowherd, trading with something which is not their own to walk on.
So right view, at least in faith, is the prerequistite for developing metta that leads into the Brahma realms or even beyond:
right view (4 Noble truth) > right resolve (=metta) > right virtue! > right meditation (development) > release
And if investigating the Karaṇīya Metta-Sutta one finds that in the starting verses.

He who is skilful in his welfare,
  And wishes to attain that state of Peace (e.g. at least a firm faith-follower, instructed, and after Nibbana)
  Should act thus:...

Further, there is not really any evidence that such as metta-bhavana was taught much toward people of wrong view.

"Now, Kalamas, one who is a disciple of the noble ones — thus devoid of greed, devoid of ill will, undeluded, alert, & resolute — keeps pervading the first direction [the east] — as well as the second direction, the third, & the fourth — with an awareness imbued with good will. Thus he keeps pervading above, below, & all around, everywhere & in every respect the all-encompassing cosmos with an awareness imbued with good will: abundant, expansive, immeasurable, free from hostility, free from ill will.

And at least, metta is deply connected with even conventional right view, not to speak that "maha-metta" is an application of Noble Ones.

"And how is one made pure in three ways by mental action? There is the case where a certain person is not covetous. He does not covet the belongings of others, thinking, 'O, that what belongs to others would be mine!' He bears no ill will and is not corrupt in the resolves of his heart. [He thinks,] 'May these beings be free from animosity, free from oppression, free from trouble, and may they look after themselves with ease!' He has right view and is not warped in the way he sees things: 'There is what is given, what is offered, what is sacrificed. There are fruits & results of good & bad actions. There is this world & the next world. There is mother & father. There are spontaneously reborn beings; there are brahmans & contemplatives who, faring rightly & practicing rightly, proclaim this world & the next after having directly known & realized it for themselves.' This is how one is made pure in three ways by mental action."
— AN 10.176

There is a generouse and very useful essay on metta by Ven. Ñāṇadassana as gift of Dhamma: Karaṇīya Metta-Sutta, including also detail explainings of the prerequisites of metta-development as means for higher and beyond.
The generous essay Metta Means Goodwill helps to get ride of certain popular missunderstandings.
There have been related answers on the topic before and maybe my person can add them here later:

Some words on blessings
How to view people with metta and karuna?

Best wishes that householder soon arrives at right metta, right view and/or pushes if further till highest liberation.

...And not holding to [wrong] view,
  Being virtuous, endowed with right vision,
  And discarding desire for sensual pleasures,
  One surely never again will be reborn
  in a womb.

A possible extended Answer, as well as given space for discussion and deriving questions, can be accessed here: [Q&A] How does metta sutra, how is metta, loving kindness, develop?
(Note that this Dhamma gift is not given for trade, exchange, stacks, entertainments to bind or conduct demerits with it, but for release from this wheel)

Metta sutra says "May all living beings be happy minded." This seems illogical to me as all living beings cannot be happy minded at a particular moment of time.

It seems illogical because your interpretation is not in alignment with reality! There are a few things I will say to just barely scratch the surface of explantion, but hopefully it will be useful for you to search deeper into your own experience.

There are no living beings. The core of Buddhism teaches a false belief in self that must be seen through in order to know the true nature of reality. If there is no "you", (spoiler alert) there isn't anyone else either. This false understanding of self is at the core of what brings about the arising of illusion and dukkha.
Time is also a part of the illusion. Outside of the illusion, there is no use for the concept of time.

I interpret the phrase as something akin to wishing someone well. I see it as a similar phrase to "I hope you have a good day". I would not interpret it literally, for if it is taken that way, it is in direct conflict with Buddhist teachings.

I also feel that contemplating on anything that is false will not lead me to the ultimate truth. In my view loving kindness should be better cultivated by knowing the true nature of things because if we get insight into real nature of things then we will automatically develop kindness by clearly seeing dukkha and we would be able to understand the suffering of others in a better way.

You are absolutely correct in your understanding. If you attempt to cultivate loving kindness without first uprooting the illusion, you will be fighting a losing battle. The belief in self will cause unskillful habits and mental states to arise, pushing back against the work you are doing to cultivate loving kindness. It is much more effective to first see through the illusion. Once this perspective is observed, things like suffering, anger, and hatred (things that directly seem to "suppress" loving kindness) arise less and less, therefore allowing the natural loving kindness that is ever present to shine through more easily.
If your garden is overwhelmed with weeds, you would never just trim the leaves and hope that is enough to kill the plant. The only way to effectively deal with the arising of something unskillful, is to yank it out at its root, so that it doesn't arise again.
I hope you are well and I pray for nothing more than your liberation this lifetime!

By the term 'being' I meant the five aggregates combined together (metaphysically).

There are many suttas that discuss mettāsahagatena. Let's look at a quote from one of these, SN46.54:

‘Come, mendicants, give up these five hindrances, corruptions of the heart that weaken wisdom, and meditate spreading a heart full of love to one direction, and to the second, and to the third, and to the fourth. In the same way above, below, across, everywhere, all around, spread a heart full of love to the whole world—abundant, expansive, limitless, free of enmity and ill will.

Here the translation states "spread a heart full of love to the whole world". This is similar to "May all living being be happy-minded." Yet it is subtly different. The difference is the emphasis of living with an open heart absent ill-will. We start with ourselves and wish that others, all others, come to this understanding of metta as well.
It is easy to wish that loved ones be happy-minded. Yet that would be limited. Notice that the sutta clearly mentions "the whole world." And the world includes people who kill, lie, cheat, steal, etc. How could we wish them happiness? It seems illogical.
And yet, if one gives up killing, lying, cheating, stealing, etc., there is less suffering. Therefore, surely we should wish an end of suffering to the whole world. That would be logical.
The difficulty with the translation "happy-minded" is that it could be understood in several ways, some of which are completely illogical (i.e., should we smile all the time to show we are happy?). However, "happy-minded" can also be understood to mean "inclined towards happiness for all".  Indeed, it is logical that suffering would be less if we were all inclined towards happiness for all.
And to be always inclined towards happiness for all, we would have to relinquish dukkha (greed, hate and delusion). In particular, we would have to relinquish identity view.

The Metta Sutta says:

Sukhino va khemino hontu, Sabbasattā bhavantu sukhitattā.
Wishing: In gladness and in safety, May all beings be at ease
In safety and in bliss, May creatures all be of a blissful heart.
May all be well and secure, May all beings be happy!
May all beings be happy and safe. May they have happy minds.
Think: Happy, at rest, may all beings be happy at heart.
May beings all live happily and safe, and may their hearts rejoice
  within themselves.

I think the above practise of metta is not a magical unrealistic expectation that others be happy but is the practise of you personally acting when interacting with others to put others at ease, such as, for example, to be friendly towards them, to honor them, to make them feel good via your own radiating of love towards them, to not criticize them, to not feel ill-will or judgment towards them (which they may sense), to have unconditional love towards them, to not rebuke them for their wrong heretical puthujjana views about Buddhism, to not call them & not treat them as 'puthujjana', etc.

If, mendicants, a mendicant cultivates a mind of love (mettācittaṃ)
  even as long as a finger snap, they’re called a mendicant who does not
  lack absorption, who follows the Teacher’s instructions, who responds
  to advice, and who does not eat the country’s alms in vain. How much
  more so those who make much of it!”
AN 1.53

It wouln't help if there is no sacca and speaking flavoring words in aspecting reputations, at least not in the eyes of wise, and kamma for an ending of kamma. But great if one would seriously change ones mind, of what requires enter to be unshakeble. puthujjana, worldling gives about 30+ answers. There are many who use metta to trap others or use it for well considered ill-will.

@dhammadhatu I have a doubt regarding some other recent question(I am not commenting there as i do not have enough reputation). You told that it was 'equimanity' that the user was experiencing. Is equimanity the final stage of the type of meditation described by the OP(observation of one's thoughts).

No, The user had not experienced 4th jhana. However, merely some basic equanimity. Not all equanimity is jhana. Regards

How do you know that the user didn't experience 4th jhana.

4th jhana is a supernormal heavenly realm. The questioner would not have any doubts it was jhana. Kind regards

Metta serves 2 purposes:

develop Adosa Mental Factor
break down metal classifications of

Me
Favourable beings or class of beings
Unfavourable beings or class of beings
Neutral favourable beings or class of beings

Develop Adosa Mental Factor
Doing Metta will develop this in one's mind. Just because you do this does not mean every being will be better off. In realisation of this, you can develop Upekkha.
Break Down Metal Classifications
You may classify people as:

deerness - me, friend, neutral, foe
deerness - pet (cat), pest (rat)
proximity - villager, some other area
deerness - countrymen, friendly country, unfriendly country
directions - southern, northerner, Westerner
etc.

Each of this classification you will like, dislike or be neutral about a being or group of beings. Developing Metta without bounds breaks these boundaries. Once the barriers are broken one will love everyone as one loves oneself.


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Dependent Origination and Impermanence in Buddhism
1 question: I just started learning about Buddhism and I read about the 3 marks of existence. When Buddhism speaks about impermanence does impermanence only refer to our experience (the 5 skhandas) or is outisde world phenomena included and considered impermanent. As I understood it impermanence is a key Buddhist principle. How does Buddhism describe time according to this impermanence doctrine and what is impermanence relationship and connection with time. I have seen a few answers here on a similar question/topic but not really this one so I hope I will get a few answers that can help me understand it.
2 question: Is a dependently arising cycle considered happening in a split second or how fast is it considered happening and what is its relationship and connection with time ??

Impermanence includes everything. For the record, Buddhism only uses the references like inside and outside as compromises with unenlightened way of thinking. In the strict sense, these notions of Inner and Outer arise as result of Dependent Origination. When you go out of subjective frame of reference and speak about Mind Processes at large, everything is unfolding all the time, with some patterns emerging as seeming Inner and Outer.

Technically, this Unfolding IS Being IS Time, as explained by Dogen in his famous lecture on the topic. In other words, it's not that Time is a container for Everything. It is identical with Being or Unfolding, but we sentient beings like to delineate certain aspects, because our minds are reification machines that work in terms of entities and their background. So for us it's only natural to think of time as background or container of events.

Dependent Origination unfolds over time, just like everything else. However, it would be incorrect to talk about concrete time scale, because DO talks about high-level principles in terms of functional relationship. Yes, the seedling comes from the seed and this happens over time, but we don't have to talk about a specific seed, we talk about the principle at large.

Buddhism says "sabbe sankhara anicca: all conditioned things are impermanent". A "conditioned thing" is anything put together & dependent upon causes & conditions, which includes material things, such as rocks, planets & universes. SN 22.90 says:

Form, friend Channa, is impermanent. Feeling is impermanent. Perception is impermanent. Mental formations (saṃkhārā) are
  impermanent. Consciousness is impermanent. Form is not-self. Feeling
  is not-self. Perception is not-self. Mental formations are not-self.
  Consciousness is not-self. All (sabbe) conditioned things (saṃkhārā)
  are impermanent (aniccā). All (sabbe) phenomena (dhammā) are not-self
  (anattā).

"Time" is also something impermanent, whether it is "mental time" (born from expectation or craving) or "physical time" (the days & nights passing). AN 10.48 contains the phrase: "rattindivā vītivattant: days & nights passing".
Each condition of dependently arising is also a conditioned thing, therefore it is subject to "time" ("arising & passing") and impermanence. Of dependent origination, SN 12.20 says:

And what, bhikkhus, are the dependently arisen phenomena? Aging-and-death, bhikkhus, is impermanent, conditioned, dependently
  arisen, subject to destruction, vanishing, fading away, and
  cessation.

However, that the mind suffers due to the conditions in dependent origination, this reality is permanent. In other words, whenever there is suffering, it must always arise due to dependent origination. SN 12.20 says:

And what, bhikkhus, is dependent origination?... whether there is an arising of Tathagatas or no arising of Tathagatas, that element still
  persists, the stableness of the Dhamma, the fixed course of the
  Dhamma, specific conditionality.

In regard to your question, three characteristics of existence apply to cling aggregate.
Clinging aggregate includes all our experience internal, external, far, near, gross, subtle, etc.
In regard to your second question, there are two schools of thought. The popular belief is one life model or the instant Dependent Origination. But when you speak conventionally it applies to three life model of past, present, and future.

Is a dependently arising cycle considered happening in a split second
  or how fast is it considered happening and what is its relationship
  and connection with time ??

Short answer: Dependent arising applies to any and all units of time.
Long answer: The way i understand it, there are probably several answers regarding the temporal aspects of dependent arising, but one view is that it's the agent/motor to an eternal reproduction of phenomena, not to mention suffering (and the cessation of suffering) specifically.
We can describe the results of our actions as karma, and as such these consequences can be instantaneous, delayed over generations, or maintained for an eternity (samsara), and everything inbetween.

Most of the people thinks the impermanence is the heart of the Buddhism. But the real heart is insatiability. People always try to be happy and running after pleasure but the nature of the world is "everything is insatiable". Just because when we can't get satisfied, we just get upset, angry or even this leads to killing people. And also the important part is when we get satisfied we think it's because of the outside world and we get attached to that out side world. (eg: when you find your partner you get attached to her thinking you are happy now because of her (outside world). And you feel you are satisfied, as almost everything is as expected - But the truth is, no matter what you think, it happened because that's how it supposed to happen (The nature of the world - Hethu Pala). To understand this, is up to you. Keeping this aside if I answer your question as below which is general to both impermanence and insatiability,

Buddhism speaks about impermanence does impermanence only refer to our experience (the 5 skhandas) or is outisde world phenomena included
  and considered impermanent.

Whether it's impermanence or insatiability, The answer to this is, it's not only for the 5 skandas, it applies for the outside world as well. But there are only 6 places, where we can connect to the outside world through these 5-skandas, which are; eye, year, nose, tongue, body and mind.
2 question: Is a dependently arising cycle considered happening in a split second or how fast is it considered happening and what is its relationship and connection with time ??
In this cycle, the 10th Nidana called Bhava has two types, One is which causes to another birth and the other one which causes to Karma (The reference can be found in Wibhanga-1 -> Paticca-samuppada-vibhangaya).
So the Karma cycle is happening in a fraction of a second. More details has to be taken from Abhidaharma section. It explains about time which takes to create one thought in the mind (Chittakshana, Chitta witi). So in simple Karma-dependently-arising-cycle runs every time we see things, we smell things, we tastes things and so on. The cycle regarding the birth, will happened on the moment of death.
About the time, generally buddha has mentioned to maintain the past, present and future as it's needed to explain things. But mainly the time dimension is something human has built just to explain things. When there are hethu (reasons / causes) it will generate a pala (result) as a result.

"not only the 5 skandas, it applies for the outside world as well.", Upasaka, what should be the different of outside world and the clinging aggregats? Maybe something to investigate, best by looking for oneself. Maybe he likes to investigate if the outside has anything lasting.

Outside world: is the world which are made from four basics (apo, thejo, wayo, patavi). World in the mind (inside world) has two parts. One is just identifying and the second is attaching to that. That is; From 5-aggregates (panchaskandhaya) we get to know these exist in the world. And when this becomes clinging aggregates (pancha-upadanaskandhaya) we are attached to the world.

My person asked Upasaka to watch out with yoniso manasikkha for himselves. What perceives dathus? What is required to enter stream?  Dhatu Sutta. May Upasaka not get after the fourth person. What is All?

If not starting with rupa, form, leaving home,the destiny asanja-satta can be expected. So from gross to fine. Domanassa is "just" a part of the whole suffering, the finer one, so fist things first.

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Do enlightened people "know" what nirvana is like?
Do enlightened people "know" what nirvana is like? Obviously, they can't express it to anyone else, so the question isn't super helpful. I just wondered whether nirvana is a thing that we can know as well as experience or taste.
One response, one I don't (personally) want to hear about (at least without some in depth quotation) is that nirvana isn't "like" anything. And, of course, nirvana isn't similar to anything.
I'm asking whether Buddhas of any sort "know" the qualities (e.g. bliss) of nirvana.

Ud 8.1 says Nibbana is a sense object (ayatana) therefore it is obviously something known.
MN 26 says:

Then the thought occurred to me, 'This Dhamma that I have attained is
  deep, hard to see, hard to realize, peaceful, refined, beyond the
  scope of conjecture, subtle, to-be-experienced (vedanīya) by the wise.

SN 56.11 says:

‘This noble truth of the cessation of suffering has been realized (sacchikata).’

Concise Pali English Dictionary sacchikata pp. of sacchikaroti
  realised; experienced for oneself.
PTS Pali English Dictionary sacchikata seen with one’s own eyes,
  realized experienced

The Dhammapada says:

205. Having savored the taste of solitude and peace (of Nibbana), pain-free and stainless he becomes, drinking deep the taste of the
  bliss of the Truth.

Nibbana is the dropping of all burdens; like the experience of relief when urgently urinating or dropping a heavy backpack or drinking cool fresh water on a hot day.
Read more here: SN 43.14-43 and Nibbana For Everyone

thanks, i accepted this answer due to the use of 'Truth', which is easily understood.

Nirvana is an application of the fire-metaphor (a fire going out) used to point at certain aspects of The Goal.
What aspects?

dispassion, disenchantment
the finality (no state subtler than this, nothing further to be attained, no realization that is more fundamental, no fuel to burn, no further becoming)

There are other aspects of The Goal not covered by the metaphor of Nirvana, and to indicate these aspects we use other concepts, namely

liberation
peace
suchness
Enlightenment, Awakening, Knowledge
bliss, happiness
the emptiness
the other shore
the deathless
the unconditional
one's true nature
the unborn

These describe various other aspects of The Goal (not of Nirvana, which is just one concept among many).
It is therefore incorrect to say that Buddha knows Nirvana or experiences Nirvana. Buddha experiences what Buddha experiences, and he can invent various ways to talk about it, including the metaphors like Nirvana. Buddha knows and experiences The Truth, and Nirvana is only a didactic device used to talk about attainment of Truth and its personal implications.
All these terms and descriptions remain in the conceptual field, as qualities or aspects that try to characterize The Goal by relating it with something the listener knows from his own unenlightened experience.
In one important sense, attainment of Nirvana is a personal transformation. As you change, reality you perceive changes as well, so all these concepts are attempts to describe both the change as well as the new reality, in contrast with old.

Is that hearsaying, or where does it origin from?

This originates from 2600 years of study and practice of Buddha-Dharma, including 25 years in this life.

"It is therefore incorrect to say that Buddha knows Nirvana or experiences Nirvana."... ! .... Mahayana's Taoist non-conceptuality is not 2600 years old, although Taoism is

No, it's not about nonconceptuality. Just about not confusing the concepts with reality. Buddha knows and experiences The Truth, and Nirvana is only a didactic device used to talk about attainment of Truth.

When a fire is extinguished, are you saying the transformation from heat to coolness is a "didactic device"? Thanks

"Path" is a metaphor. Etc.

And yes, heat and coolness are only one way to talk about reality, which can also be described as the slowing down of the vibrations of atoms. Etc.

The Upanishads ask, 'Who is there to experience the experiencer?'. The Buddha goes beyond experience for Truth and Reality. Thus to ask what buddhas experience as Nirvana may be to slightly miss their message. Nagarjuna proposes that we much travel beyond the Samsara-Nirvana distinction for the final goal, as suggested by Andrei. . .  ,.

Bhikkhu Sujato translated part of MN 49 as:

Consciousness that is invisible, infinite, radiant all round—that’s
  what is not within the scope of experience based on earth, water,
  fire, air, creatures, gods, the Creator, Brahmā, the gods of streaming
  radiance, the gods replete with glory, the gods of abundant fruit, the
  Overlord, and the all.
Viññāṇaṃ anidassanaṃ anantaṃ sabbato pabhaṃ, ...

This translation is problematic because there is no such thing as infinite consciousness in Buddhism. Equating Nirvana with infinite consciousness would be more of Advaita Vedanta rather than Buddhism.
However, in this answer, Bonn explained that this is a wrong translation.
It should rather be:

That which could be known (Nibbana),
  is invisible, infinite, radiant all round—that’s
  what is not within the scope of experience based on earth, water,
  fire, air, creatures, gods, the Creator, Brahmā, the gods of streaming
  radiance, the gods replete with glory, the gods of abundant fruit, the
  Overlord, and the all.
Viññāṇaṃ anidassanaṃ anantaṃ sabbato pabhaṃ, ...

So, Nirvana is something knowable, but it is not within the normal scope of physical and mental experience. It is not even within the normal scope of the experience of gods.
How do the enlightened ones know and experience Nirvana as?
From AN 3.32:

‘This is peaceful (santaṃ), this is sublime (paṇītaṃ),
  that is, the stilling of all
  activities, the relinquishing of all acquisitions, the destruction of
  craving, dispassion, cessation, nibbāna.’

From Dhammapada 204:

... Nibbana is the greatest bliss. (nibbanam paramam sukham)

They know and experience Nirvana as the greatest bliss, that is peaceful and sublime, and free from all suffering.
The ending of AN 3.32:

‘Having surveyed the world high and low,
  they’re not shaken by anything in the world.
  Peaceful, unclouded, untroubled, with no need for hope—
  they’ve crossed over birth and old age, I declare.’”

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Is it correct that dependent origination will cease to exist if one doesn't have 12 nidanas?
From Pratītyasamutpāda - Wikipedia:

dependent origination refers to nothing else but the process of mental conditioning as described by the twelve nidanas

So to check if my understanding is correct, will dependent origination cease to exist if one doesn't have 12 nidanas?
In my understanding, dependant origination is just an extended understanding of "condition". For example, if I say "plants need water, soil and light to grow", then water, soil and light are the originations. This doesn't seem to relate to the mental condition of the observer. So how do the two relate?
And in general, how does one know that all dependent originations of a thing are "depleted"?

will dependent origination cease to exist if one doesn't have 12 nidanas?
I think it's a description of how mental conditions originate -- for example, the origination of feelings depend on contact, the origination of craving depends on feelings, etc.
I think it is meant to be possible to stop (arrest) this "wheel of becoming" -- and that a place (on the wheel) where you can do that is at "feelings" -- e.g. if there's "contact" with things (i.e. sensory contact and perception), but without indulging in feelings (e.g. feelings like "delight" or "loathing"), then (without their being "feelings") then subsequent nidanas (e.g. "craving" and "attachment") won't originate.
I think that practice is called "guarding the senses" (where "senses" includes "the mind" -- which senses mind-objects e.g. thoughts, like the eye senses sight-objects etc.).
And in general, how does one know that all dependent originations of a thing are "depleted"?
What is effluent? might be relevant -- see also Four stages of enlightenment.

I see. So the 12 nidanas just pertain to cognitive creatures (like human). There are certainly originations that are for non-living objects, like gravitation. Is that correct? If so, then perhaps the phrase "nothing else" in Wikipedia is quite misleading?

I don't know what we're to understand about the origination of non-living objects like gravitation. I think that they (unlike nibanna) are said to be "dependently originated" too -- e.g. "space" depends on the existence of "things" between which you can measure a distance, similarly "time" wouldn't exist without "events" -- so "dependent origination" is a theory broadly applicable, whereas the "12 nidanas" are a specific application of that theory to describe the origination of e.g. "craving" and "birth" etc. which are or were of interest to (relevant to) other Buddhist practice and doctrine.

I guess I just contradicted Wikipedia's saying "nothing else but". I think that dependent origination -- in the suttas -- appears "principally" in the context of the 12 nidanas. I think it, at least, influences the descriptions of reality from later or contemporary Buddhists, who might (trying to explain the concept of "dependent origination") give similes like "a plant depends on a seed and water and sunlight etc." -- not that I remember specific examples of people saying that.

That simile is from Thich Nhat Hanh to explain Nagarjuna's Middle Way, and I think it's to illustrate the emptiness of the plant more than to illustrate the conditions/dependent originations of it. Do you think this idea (the reality is empty, not just our mental condition) is also from later Buddhists, and not appears much on the suttas (which I think emphasize more on getting free)?

will dependent origination cease to exist if one doesn't have 12 nidanas?

Yes.

In my understanding, dependant origination is just an extended understanding of "condition". For example, if I say "plants need
  water, soil and light to grow", then water, soil and light are the
  originations. This doesn't seem to relate to the mental condition of
  the observer. So how do the two relate?

'Paticcasumuppada' ('Dependent Co-Arising') is the subset of 'Idappaccayatā' ('Conditionality') that explains the 12 conditions for the arising of mental suffering. The suttas say:

And what is dependent co-arising? From ignorance as a requisite condition come fabrications. From fabrications as a requisite
  condition comes consciousness. From consciousness as a requisite
  condition comes name-&-form. From name-&-form as a requisite condition
  come the six sense media. From the six sense media as a requisite
  condition comes contact. From contact as a requisite condition comes
  feeling. From feeling as a requisite condition comes craving. From
  craving as a requisite condition comes clinging. From
  clinging as a requisite condition comes becoming. From
  becoming as a requisite condition comes birth. From birth as a
  requisite condition, then aging & death, sorrow, lamentation, pain,
  distress, & despair come into play. Such is the origination of this
  entire mass of stress & suffering.

The conditionality related to the arising or coming-to-be of trees is not called 'Paticcasumuppada'. The arising of trees is merely an example of general 'Idappaccayatā'.

And in general, how does one know that all dependent originations of a thing are "depleted"?

This question is not valid because not all examples or occurrences of 'Idappaccayatā' are 'Paticcasumuppada'. The mind (while living) can experience the depletion of 'Paticcasumuppada' but the mind (while living) cannot experience the depletion of 'Idappaccayatā'. Even though the suffering of 'Paticcasumuppada' can end; the 'Idappaccayatā' of Nature will continue to be discerned. In short, suffering can end but trees will continue to grow, clouds will continue to form, the body will continue to live nourished by food, consciousness will continue to operate conditioned by sense organs, etc.

'Idappaccayatā'.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idappaccayat%C4%81

will dependent origination cease to exist if one doesn't have 12
  nidanas?

In Buddhism, what should be uprooted is Ignorance (Avidyā, Avijja) which is the first nidana in dependent origin. This results to cease the other 11 nidanas in dependent origin.

And in general, how does one know that all dependent originations of a
  thing are "depleted"?

When someone uprooted the Ignorance it becomes very clear to him. Because who ever in the path to Nivana knows what's ignorance and when they uprooted they just know there's no more Ignorance in the mind.

I can only try to answer your first question like this:
Dependent origination is - among several things - a theory to describe how our perceptions are created. As such it's not a question whether you have the nidanas or not. To make a comparison, that would be similar to asking whether we can have gravity or not. Gravity is present under certain circumstances, and is absent under other circumstances.
Dependent origination can perhaps be compared to the western idea of an ontological axiom, meaning it's a theoretical framework to interpret and understanding how phenomena arise and cease.

There are five Niyamas subject to Mode of Conditioning applied for mental and physical.
The way I understand When Buddha taught Dependent Origination he was talking about the arising of Dukkha hence the application of mental phenomena.
Hence Arhant Body (Physical) is still subject to DO. However, his mental factors subject to DO has ceased. (ending birth)
http://103.242.110.22/theravadins/English-articles/abhidhamma-in-practice.pdf


text:
Spiritual Potential and Consequences of Actions
Upon reading this question, I wondered: would a person with great spiritual potential, without compassion, be more likely to cause great harm than an average person? Not intentionally, but say due to anger or hate; would this person be akin to a politician with great power who's actions can affect more?
Thus, would spiritual potent individuals' actions have greater consequences under the effect of negative states?

Instead of "spiritual potential", you probably meant those with supernormal powers/Iddhi capability right? because those with higher spiritual potential would naturally tend to act/speak/think in a more skillful way than those who don't. If that's the case then sure. Just like that common expression "with great power comes great responsibility". A foot soldier can save or kill someone with just his weapon, but an emperor can build or annihilate an entire country with just an order! So probably a more apt expression would be: "with great power comes great kammic consequences".

Yet think what a mind-master is able to, not even use words. Kamma by mind is far more powerful than physical actions could.


text:
Pride and Compassion
I have read in psychological studies that oxytocin and serotonin interact to produce social rewards. Serotonin has been postulated to relate to authentic pride (a positive kind of pride based on accomplishment). Oxytocin is a hormone linked with compassion. Therefore, it would seem natural that pride and compassion relate in some way.
Even, I will say that when I meditated on compassion, imagery of altruistic pride naturally emerged. Recently, I'm in a more depressed state -- which may entail less serotonin -- and the pride imagery fails to occur as well as the reward.
My question is: is there any evidence of such an interaction between compassion and pride in Buddhism? I feel naturally emptiness entails an interaction with compassion in the Mahayana, but I feel pride would be linked with desire and materiality.
Authentic pride is based on accomplishment, not feeling superior to others (hubristic pride). Does Buddhism have a place for such attachment?

Possibly related -- How are 'conceit' and 'identity-view' not the same?, and, What is the difference between 'compassion' and 'pity'?

I think this is an interesting question, and also the words "evidence" and "buddhism" in the same sentence is particularly interesting to me. If i'm not mistaken the onus of evidence is exclusively the responsibility of a buddhist practitioner, no? (I'm not counting suttas as evidence, obviously).

Authentic pride is based on accomplishment, not feeling superior to others (hubristic pride). Does Buddhism have a place for such attachment?

Not sure if such concept has a place in the Teaching. If authentic pride is based on accomplishment, then it's important to notice that "accomplishment" in the Dhamma is just a label, or a word expression to denote how much one has given up instead of picked up. For example, one's accomplishment in Sotapanna-hood/Stream-entry is simply a label to denote someone who has completely given up the 3 lower fetters: identity view, doubt, and wrong grasp of rules/rituals. Similarly for other higher "accomplishments", the higher one "attains" something, it really means the more one has "given up/let go" of something. And the highest "accomplishment", again, is really just a label for someone who has completely eliminated all hindrances/fetters/defilements of the mind.

Without having the buddhist source to back it up, i'd argue that compassion is all-encompassing, meaning that true compassion doesn't distinguish between self or others.
Pride then, would be a flavor of self-compassion, as long as we're talking about the type of pride free from arrogance or grandiose perception of the self.

In Aditya Sutta, the Buddha describes a Dhamma-following householder who expresses altruistic pride and states how this is a positive state of mind:

'My wealth has been enjoyed,
  my dependents supported,
      protected from calamities by me.
  I have given supreme offerings
      & performed the five oblations.
  I have provided for the virtuous,
      the restrained,
      followers of the holy life.
For whatever aim a wise householder
      would desire wealth,
          that aim I have attained.
  I have done what will not lead to future distress.'
  When this is recollected by a mortal,
  a person established in the Dhamma of the Noble Ones,
  he is praised in this life
      and, after death, rejoices in heaven.


text:
Was is the difference between "uparujjhati" & "nirujjhati"?
In the Pali, nirujjhati (ni + rudh + ya) appears to be a verb for the noun "nirodha".

nirujjhati
ceases; dissolves; vanishes.
to be broken up, to be dissolved, to be destroyed, to cease, die

Uparujjhati (upa + rudh + ya) appears similar in etymology, however differs in the prefix.

uparujjhati
stops or ceases
to be stopped, broken, annihilated, destroyed

I have done some examination of the usage of these words in the Pali suttas and, for now, I think their meanings or usages are contextually different.
How can these two words be linguistically distinguished?

They are not synonyms, they have different meanings derived from the same root and different prefixes.
Nirodha means stop, suppress, not allow to go on.
Uparodham means enclose, blockade.
So aparisesa nirujjhanti means "completely stopped".
But asesam uparujjhati means "fully enclosed".
So in DN11 the guy was asking about place where the physical processes are completely stopped (aparisesā nirujjhanti).
But Buddha said, that's not what we are talking about. It's about "place" where the physical elements have no footing, place inside which all concepts like beautiful, ugly etc., all namarupas, all conceptual discriminations are fully enclosed or fully en-scoped (asesaṃ uparujjhatī).
It is the universal space of information, the universal space of mind, is where they are all enclosed of course. When all discrimination is stopped and this "space" is seen in its original undivided way, is when the unborn/deathless is attained. It is this space is what we in Mahayana call Shunyata.

Thank you good kind sir. Forever grateful.

The difference is primarily in upa, which is used as an intensifier to designate the circumstance of cessation. Since it is an intensifier, we are led to read "obliteration" rather than "fading away" as for "nirujjhati", where the "ni-" is providing emphasis by repetition of meaning (i.e., ni- + rujjhati).
One can also feel the meaning of the prefixes "upa-" and "ni-" when performing physical actions:

Say "upa" when lifting or moving a heavy object. The breath is stopped briefly for exertion.
Say "ni" when putting that heavy object down. The breath is exhaled continuously and let go.

thanks for your interesting answer but i still don't understand. regards

thank you OyaMist. Your answer may possibly be similar to my conclusion, which is: "uparujjhati" is a temporary stopping, such as breath is stopped briefly for exertion. Where as "nirujjhati" can refer to a complete stopping, such as putting that heavy object down and never picking it up again. Regards

According to the PTS Pali-English dictionary entry on the prefix upa-:

Upa -- [Vedic upa; Av. upa on, up; Gr. u(po/ under, u(pe/r over; Lat.
  sub fr. *(e)ks -- upo; Goth. uf under & on; Ohg. ūf = Ags. up = E. up;
  Oir. fo under. See also upari] prefix denoting nearness or close touch
  (cp. similarly ā), usually with the idea of approach from below or
  rest on top, on, upon, up, by. -- In compn. a upa is always contracted
  to upa, e. g. devūpaṭṭhāna, lokûpaga, puññûpatthambhita. -- Meanings:
  (1) (Rest): on upon, up -- : ˚kiṇṇa covered over; ˚jīvati live on (cp.
  anu˚); ˚tthambhita propped up, sup -- ported; ˚cita heaped up, ac --
  cumulated; ˚dhāreti hold or take up; ˚nata bent on; ˚nissaya
  foundation; ...

According to the PTS Pali-English dictionary entry on rujjhati:

Rujjhati [Pass. of rundhati] to be broken up, to be destroyed J
  iii.181 (pāṇā rujjhanti; C. expls by nirujjhati). Cp. upa˚, vi˚.

Uparujjhati means "upon ceasing" with "upa-" meaning "upon" or "on", more or less.
For example, from SN 56.22:

ceases with nothing left over.
asesaṃ uparujjhati.

This means nothing left UPON ceasing. "asesa" means nothing remaining.
According to the PTS Pali-English dictionary entry on the prefix ni-

Ni˚ [Sk. ni -- & nih -- , insep. prefixes: (a) ni down=Av. ni, cp.
  Gr. neio/s lowland, nei/atos the lowest, hindmost; Lat. nīdus (*ni --
  zdos: place to sit down=nest); Ags. nēol, nider=E. nether; Goth.
  nidar=Ohg. nidar; also Sk. nīca, nīpa etc. -- (b) niḥ out, prob. fr.
  *seni & to Lat. sine without].  ...

"Nirujjhati" means "breaks down" I think with "ni-" meaning "down", more or less.
From SN 12.62:

But that which is called ‘mind’ or ‘sentience’ or ‘consciousness’
  arises as one thing and ceases as another all day and all night.
Yañca kho etaṃ, bhikkhave, vuccati cittaṃ itipi, mano itipi, viññāṇaṃ
  itipi, taṃ rattiyā ca divasassa ca aññadeva uppajjati aññaṃ
  nirujjhati.

Here, the mind rises UP as one thing (uppajjati) and breaks DOWN as another (nirujjhati).

thanks for your effort Ruben however i couldn't understand anything compelling in your explanation due to my lack of understanding. Regards

Uparujjhati  is found at the end of https://suttacentral.net/dn11/en/sujato , here https://suttacentral.net/sn1.27/en/sujato and here https://suttacentral.net/snp5.14/en/anandajoti

My answer is actually a response or comment to Andrei Volkov's highly illuminating answer; which reflects my interpretation and application of Andrei's answer.
When dependent origination ends forever (SN 12.2) or craving ends forever (SN 56.11), without ever arising again, it is called "asesa-virāga-nirodhā".
So in DN 11, the guy asks: "where do the four elements aparisesā nirujjhanti". Here,  "aparisesā" might mean "totally not remaining" (an + pari + sesa = completely not remaining) ????.
The Buddha replies this is a wrong question. The Buddha then replies in luminous consciousness, the worldly discriminations are subjected to asesaṃ uparujjhatī.
While "asesam" appears to mean "nothing left over", "uparujjhati" does not have the same meaning as "nirodha" or "nirujjhanti" because it is only in luminous consciousness that these discriminations completely cease.
In other words, even in ignorance-free craving-free enlightened ordinary consciousness, such as a Buddha or Arahant in a conventional mode (such as the Buddha telling a monk to do walking meditation over the "length of 30 short steps" or to know "long breathing" & "short breathing"), these discriminations (of long, short, fine, coarse, beautiful, ugly, naming a form) can return.
Thus these discriminations are "uparujjhati" because, unlike the cessation of ignorance for an Arahant, these conventional discriminations can return.
In other words, similar to the prefix "upa" in "upapajjati", the cessation of the discriminations is an "offshoot" of or "rests" upon the luminous consciousness (rather than is an outcome of the permanent or remainderless cessation of ignorance, which is "nirodha" or "nirujjhanti").
Thus, as Bhikkhu Sujato said: Nibbana is not viññāṇa. Really, it just isn’t.

But this does not make sense in SN 56.22, where it says "and where all suffering is fully blocked/ enclosed" (Yattha ca sabbaso dukkhaṃ, asesaṃ uparujjhati.).  It couldn't be, that when the arahant is in conventional mode, the suffering comes back? Isn't he permanently free from suffering?

OK... But it can apply to a stream entrant whose mindfulness hasn't lapsed. Once it lapses, suffering comes back.

Thanks Ruben. I missed that sutta this morning however I think it does not invalidate my conclusion because SN 56.22 does not appear to refer to Arahantship. SN 56.22 says: "And they understand the path that leads to the stilling of suffering". It sounds like stream-entry to me. Regards

Yes. As I commented, I agree. It can apply to a stream entrant. Regards

In SN 56.22, Yattha ca sabbaso dukkhaṃ, asesaṃ uparujjhati probably means, they know the extent of the scope of all suffering, the extent to which the notions of suffering make sense, the limits of the frame of reference where suffering is applicable. Knowing the limits, they know the path to escape it.


text:
What are the 4 wheels and 9 doors in Snp 1.29?
What are the four wheels and nine doors mentioned in the sutta below?
Why is it "born from a bog"?
What is the meaning of the sutta?
From the Four Wheels Sutta (Sutta Nipata 1.29):

“Having four wheels and nine doors,
  Filled up and bound with greed,
  Born from a bog, O great hero!
  How does one escape from it?”
“Having cut the thong and the strap,
  Having cut off evil desire and greed,
  Having drawn out craving with its root:
  Thus one escapes from it.”

4 limbs, 9 body openings (7 head, 2 lower) = human/being in sensual world, by up cutting of kama-chanda, one leaves the sensual realm. As quick perceived. It seems not related to direct Nibbana (althought "with it's roots" is mentioned, but the wish was related to the dirty sensual realm). Nyom might now give a good answer himself.

See also AN 2.35: Samacitta Sutta — Minds in Tune

@SamanaJohann You can submit this as an answer, Bhante.

My person would need to deeper into, that it is of use. Let's see, but Nyom usually not only rejoices but also would have the capacity to go on for a blessed answer.

More common is Chakra, for the "wheels" and might be also denote old indian models of "life-energy", usualy 5 or 7 charkras.

yep... The esoteric traditions in Buddhism generally teach four chakras.[3] In some early Buddhist sources, these chakras are identified as: manipura (navel), anahata (heart), vishuddha (throat) and ushnisha kamala (crown). https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chakra

And even to the point: catucakka an instr. of four, a lucky tetrad, a fourwheeler of the body as expressing itself in the four kinds of deportment, iriyāpathas A ii.32; S i.16, 63 (catucakkaŋ). In this sense generalized as a happy state, consisting of "4 blessings": paṭirūpadesa -- vāsa, sappurisûpassaya, atta -- sammāpaṇidhi, pubbe -- kata -- puññatā, https://dsalsrv04.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/app/pali_query.py?qs=Cakka&searchhws=yes (sugata loka, human with certain merits)

bog refers to birth in a womb, phlegm... swamp. The questioner obiviously aware of asubha of body, form.

four wheels and nine doors
It means 4 limbs(?), 9 body openings (7 head, 2 lower) -- so, a human/being in sensual world. By cutting off kama-chanda, one leaves the sensual realm (human would & other sugati realms, is bound to higher heavens). As quick perceived. It seems not related to direct Nibbana (although "with its roots" is mentioned, but the wish was related to the dirty sensual realm).
See also AN 2.35: Samacitta Sutta — Minds in Tune
Further investigations in regard of "cakka", wheel:
More common is Chakra, for the "wheels" and might be also denote old indian models of "life-energy", usualy 5 or 7 charkras, which leads to

The esoteric traditions in Buddhism generally teach four chakras.[3] In some early Buddhist sources, these chakras are identified as: manipura (navel), anahata (heart), vishuddha (throat) and ushnisha kamala (crown). en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chakra

but as still not really proper seeming, a Pali research gives a better answer:

catucakka an instr. of four, a lucky tetrad, a fourwheeler of the body as expressing itself in the four kinds of deportment, iriyāpathas A ii.32; S i.16, 63 (catucakkaŋ). In this sense generalized as a happy state, consisting of "4 blessings": paṭirūpadesa -- vāsa, sappurisûpassaya, atta -- sammāpaṇidhi, pubbe -- kata -- puññatā, https://dsalsrv04.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/app/pali_query.py?qs=Cakka&searchhws=yes

(sugati loka, human with certain merits)
bog: refers to birth in a womb, phlegm... swamp. The questioner obiviously aware of asubha of body, form.


text:
Where do hiri and ottappa (shame, and fear of wrongdoing) fit in?
Where do hiri and ottappa (shame and fear of wrongdoing) fit it, in:

The Four Noble Truths (4nt)
The Noble Eightfold Path (8aam)
The 37 Bodhipakkhiyādhammā (37bp)
The Seven Factors of Awakening (7sb)

In AN 7.67 we see it working, protecting the fortress with outer road and moat (and the remaining 5 factors are 5 indriya, and Dhamma weapons):
https://notesonthedhamma.blogspot.com/2019/06/an-767-frontier-fortress-sutta.html
In AN 7.65, it's a vital condition for sense restraint, which in turn is a vital condition for sila.

Hirīottappasutta
Conscience and Prudence
“Hirottappe, bhikkhave, asati hirottappavipannassa hatūpaniso hoti indriyasaṃvaro;
  “monks, when there is no conscience and prudence, one who lacks conscience and prudence has destroyed a vital condition for sense restraint.
indriyasaṃvare asati indriyasaṃvaravipannassa hatūpanisaṃ hoti sīlaṃ;
  When there is no sense restraint, one who lacks sense restraint has destroyed a vital condition for ethical conduct.

There are probably other entry points where it's linked in (to the 7sb, 8aam, 37bp, 4nt)?
Unlike the 4 brahmavihara formula, where each brahmavihara has the keyword "abyapajja", which is a direct link to Noble Eightfold Path -- i.e. Right Resolve -> abyapada-sankappo (non-ill-will resolve) -- I can't think of any such very direct explicit link (into 4nt and 8aam or 37bp) for hiri and ottappa.
Anyone know for sure?
(update to this question 6/25/2019)
https://notesonthedhamma.blogspot.com/2019/06/new-uped-dictionary-entries-hiri.html
I haven't yet done an exhaustive search (looking at every single occurrence of hiri and ottappa in the suttas), but I have looked at enough passages now to establish an STED (standard EBT definition) that occurs in several key passages.
It looks like the strongest tie in with the 4nt, 8aam, 37bp, etc, would be under right effort and viriya, where hiri and ottappa have a strong explicit connection with the STED right effort formula of "papaka akusala dhamma" (evil unskillful Dharma[teachings & qualities]), and also the sutta where ottappa and ātāpi are shown working together (they both have tapa, austerity, strong heat of effort in that word), and we know atapi is a key word in the 4sp (satipatthana) formula that references right effort.
Also several suttas, especially AN 4.169, have modified forms of 5bal and 5ind (bala and indriya) to incorporate hiri & ottappa. So those seem like the strongest explicit EBT tie ins that I can find so far.
But I am keeping a comprehensive encyclopedia entry for hiri & ottappa in the link above, so please feel free to share sutta references (with sutta ref number in modern numbering system, no PTS page number) on this thread and I'll add to collection. Thanks to all who contributed.

Maybe Upasaka can overcome desires and try to stick to express word and not going that much after ordinary ways of short codes, something totally improper in relation of the Dhamma and practice: generosity by giving time and knowledge. Difficult, my person knowns, but possible.

A couple of people commented on the formatting -- e.g. the use of abbreviations isn't normal on this site (I've seen "4NT" before, occasionally, but not the other abbreviations). I edited the post to explain them, but I also left them in, in case those abbreviations are easier for some people to understand than the English translations.

I also formatted the quote -- include a hyperlink to the text you're quoting; use > to format a block quote; use whitespace, an empty line to start a new paragraph, or two spaces or <br> at the end of a line to force a line break (e.g. between Pali and English in the quote). See Markdown help for more formatting help.

Let us continue this discussion in chat.

Upasaga Frank K, intetested,
- Namo tassa bhagavato arahato sammā-sambuddhassa -
☝ Shame and fear of wrong-doing requires much care how you look (in the eyes of wise)
As for The Noble Eightfold Path (ariya-magga)
Hiri & ottappa (shame & fear of wrongdoing) is an aspect of right resolve, going after the desire of not harming, causing no conflicts and restrain, renouncing (sense desires, desire after becoming). Hiri & ottappa are working here toward development of the virtue section and having the purification of virtue as result, resulting then in further refining through right effort (again a pattern of hiri & ottapa), driving one into the heart of the conncentration section. As Nyom Rubben mentioned, they work for the perfection of Sila as prerequisite of right samadhi and panna.
In The Four Frames of Reference (satipaṭṭhāna) they work at all for in the area of ardent, alert, & mindful — putting aside greed & distress with reference to the world.
The Four Right Exertions (sammappadhāna), they cover the hole drive for right effort.
Likewise in The Four Bases of Power (iddhipāda) on a refined level.
In The Five Faculties (indrīya), Sila and it's cause is found in The faculty of conviction (saddhindrīya) and faculty of persistence (viriyindrīya).
Likewise in The Five Strengths (bala) as The strength of conviction (saddhā-bala) and strength of persistence (viriya-bala)..
In The Seven Factors for Awakening (bojjhaṅga) they are included in Mindfulness as a factor for Awakening (sati-sambojjhaṅga), Analysis of qualities as a factor for Awakening (dhamma-vicaya-sambojjhaṅga), Persistence as a factor for Awakening (viriya-sambojjhaṅga).
So hiri & opatta are factors supporting Conviction: Right Speech (Eightfold Path), Right Action (Eightfold Path), Right Livelihood (Eightfold Path), Desire (Bases of Power) and Persistence: Right Effort (Eightfold Path), Four Right Exertions, Persistence (Bases of Power) Persistence (Factors for Awakening).
As coming from Right resolve, effort, bases on right view,  hiri & opatta has right view as for-runner:

There is the case where a certain person is not covetous. He does not covet the belongings of others, thinking, 'O, that what belongs to others would be mine!' He bears no ill will and is not corrupt in the resolves of his heart. [He thinks,] 'May these beings be free from animosity, free from oppression, free from trouble, and may they look after themselves with ease!' He has right view and is not warped in the way he sees things: 'There is what is given, what is offered, what is sacrificed. There are fruits & results of good & bad actions. There is this world & the next world. There is mother & father. There are spontaneously reborn beings; there are brahmans & contemplatives who, faring rightly & practicing rightly, proclaim this world & the next after having directly known & realized it for themselves.' This is how one is made pure in three ways by mental action."

One lacking in right view may think before or/and after deeds: to deny responsibility, to deny that harm was actually done, to deny the worth of the victim, to attack the accuser, and to claim that they were acting in the service of a higher cause.
And the Buddhas cut offs, maintained by right view are: (1) We are always responsible for our conscious choices. (2) We should always put ourselves in the other person's place. (3) All beings are worthy of respect. (4) We should regard those who point out our faults as if they were pointing out treasure. (5) There are no — repeat, no — higher purposes that excuse breaking the basic precepts of ethical behavior. (see Reconciliation, Right & Wrong, in regard of changing ways)
Usual sense-desire and desire for becoming (joy, happiness) are the "higher pruposes" why people lose shame and fear of wrongdoing.
(right) Hiri & Opatta are governed be the desire for becoming and to a state even beyind becoming, to leve behind low stands, states and enter that of the Noble Ones, governed by one or all three governing principles (right view):

"There are these three governing principles. Which three? The self as a governing principle, the cosmos as a governing principle, and the Dhamma as a governing principle. ...Adhipateyya Sutta: Governing Principles

As there is shame and fear of wrong doing actually present in all beings and actions, but for the most shame in doing good and fear to lose face under fools, this talk may be usefull supply to leave associations with fools toward wise:
In the Eyes of the Wise: The Buddha’s Teachings on Honor & Shame
May no one be ever ashamed in doing merits and may no one fear to do wrong what fools regard as their refuge, to find real happiness for oneself with ease.
A possible extended answer, with further cross-links and given space for discussion and further investigation can be found here:
[Q&A] Where does hiri & ottappa (shame & fear of wrongdoing) fit in the Path?
(Note that this is not given for trade, exchange, stacks or entertainment but for development of restrain from unskillful toward liberation and make meritorious deeds with and on it)

The purpose of the shame and fear of wrongdoing is to promote virtue (sila) and good conduct.
From the Noble Eightfold Path, Right Action, Right Speech and Right Livelihood comprise the portion on virtue (sila). The Five Precepts are also for virtue.
The Noble Eightfold Path comes from the fourth noble truth of The Four Noble Truths i.e. the path to ending suffering.
From AN 5.57:

"And for the sake of what benefit should a woman or a man, a
  householder or one gone forth, often reflect thus: ‘I am the owner of
  my kamma, the heir of my kamma; I have kamma as my origin, kamma as my
  relative, kamma as my resort; I will be the heir of whatever kamma,
  good or bad, that I do’? People engage in misconduct by body, speech,
  and mind. But when one often reflects upon this theme, such misconduct
  is either completely abandoned or diminished. It is for the sake of
  this benefit that a woman or a man, a householder or one gone forth,
  should often reflect thus: ‘I am the owner of my kamma, the heir of my
  kamma; I have kamma as my origin, kamma as my relative, kamma as my
  resort; I will be the heir of whatever kamma, good or bad, that I do.’

As you have quoted correctly, AN 7.65 says that hiri and ottappa are important for the practice of virtue (or ethical conduct):

"Mendicants, when there is no conscience and prudence, one who lacks
  conscience and prudence has destroyed a vital condition for sense
  restraint.
“Hirottappe, bhikkhave, asati hirottappavipannassa
  hatūpaniso hoti indriyasaṃvaro;
When there is no sense restraint, one who lacks sense restraint has
  destroyed a vital condition for ethical conduct.
indriyasaṃvare asati
  indriyasaṃvaravipannassa
  hatūpanisaṃ hoti sīlaṃ;


text:
PIN POTHA (puñña potha) or Merit Book, costom still alive? How to keep it up?
My person just came across an answer by Upasak Suminda Sirinath S. Dharmasena, mentioning:

Also there is a concept of Pin Potha, which is a journal of all good deeds done.

And

It is an age old custom of the Sri Lankan Buddhists to maintain a record of One's meritorious activities. This record is named PIN POTHA or Merit Book.

Since such is not only a perfect daily reflection means, fitting in the praised Anussatis: Recollection of one's own virtues (silanussati),
Recollection of one's own generosity (caganussati),
Recollection of the own qualities equal the devas (devatanussati), but also as telling, reminding very sick and dying people on their good deeds as support, my person wonders whether this custom is still alive.
Is such, keeping records of ones merits done,  still practiced in Sri Lanka?
And, since it can be used perfect also for the practice of sharing merits and the practice of rejoicing in merits, my person wonders if there are ideas how to make the basic practices more virtual, vital, knowing that modern people are hardly to motivate toward the basic practices. They might possible needs such as a "reputation system", possible implemented in other daily used software or online services.
[Some "experiments" had been done to encourage the nearly death basic section, such as Anumodana or mail-list, next to a section in use, to get some ideas.]
(Note that this is not given for use for trade, exchange, stacks or entertainment but for encouragement toward release and benefical undertakings toward such)

As a Sri Lankan, I've heard these in our grand parent times (within last 20-30 years back). With the current lifestyle, everyone has started looking for happiness in outer world, most of the people have forgotten these kind of customs / traditions. This doesn't imply that Pin Potha is no longer active in Sri Lanka, but I should say its very hard to find now a days.
As I've heard the main purpose of this book is, when the owner of the book is about to die and while laying on the bed (Here it's talking about natural death with aging, because that's how the most of the people died in back old days, no sudden heart attacks) someone else starts reading the book to the owner. The concept behind this is, to make his next life a better one ( next birth in human world or heaven not the hell)
How that happens is the bhava in Pratītyasamutpāda is caused by the previous Nidanas. So if he can have good Saṅkhāra (mental fabrication) based on what he hears (from Pin Potha) at the last fractions of seconds, it will results to create a good Bhava. This is the concept behind this action as I've understood.

Thank you for the insight. That sounds similar to, stories in which bhikkhus comfort a dying bhikkhu by asking him to reflect on what he has attained through the practice, which was apparently a common way of encouraging a dying bhikkhu to focus his thoughts on the best object possible quoted from page 82 of this.

It's to lift the mind to access-concentration by Caga-nussati, Sila-Nussati, Deva-anussati. And that one does not get fearful and gain so a higher rebirth.

So modern Sri Lankan will not have much support for good rebirth.

@SamanaJohann, thing is this is more like a custom or tradition. But according to Dhamma this doesn’t guarantee that the will get a good rebirth. The only guarantee for the good rebirth (not the hell) is being at least a stream entrant. That’s what dhamma says.

Don't say so, don't say so. The state of mind at death is most relvant for ones rebirth! As Upasaka Lal, since more likely to follow householders advices. As you might no the opposit as well, having hold right view, kept silas, if at the moment of death wrong view, one is destinated to hell. It's pure practice and one should train for the time to come the whole life! Ask those learned scriptual Abhidhamma of what determines the rebirth consciousness. Don't spend time with westerns modern, you loose all your good traditions, Dhamma practice.

Don't spend time with westerns modern, you loose all your good traditions, Dhamma practice.

Here, as a sample wheb the Buddha "read" out of "Mahanamas" Merit book: http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/tipitaka/sn/sn55/sn55.021.than_en.html of course to write into one needs to perform fist.

Nakula's fathers "death story" and the "re-reading from the book" by his wife http://zugangzureinsicht.org/html/tipitaka/an/an06/an06.016.than_en.html

Agreed on your points. What I tried to say is, we should not rely on PinPotha, we should follow the path. With Metta

Sure, Upasaka, better to remind the good and to desire to repeat if more refined and possible even reach the path.People are advices to relay on their Pin, have kamma, kusala as well as their heritage, relay on it, for better becoming and beyond. See also advices to Rahula, as what to make with good deeds after long term reflection:

"...But if on reflection you know that it did not lead to affliction... it was a skillful mental action with pleasant consequences, pleasant results, then you should stay mentally refreshed & joyful, training day & night in skillful mental qualities." Start as soon as possible to store a "Pin potha".

Agreed, no argument on that. But when we think widely, why we are loosing these kind of practices? Instead of worrying on the after life, people have started attracting to modern stuff, thinking they can get pleasure out of those, but just because those not make them satisfy they just keep running on these, and forgetting the old customs. Why? That's the nature of the world. It won't behave as we want. So only thing we should do in the present moment is follow the noble path. Coz even if we get a good immediate next birth we can't guarantee the second one, can we?


text:
Would a wise person avoide situations where other could perform lot of demerits?
Would a wise person avoide situations where other could perform lot of demerits?
Or different asked: Would a wise person go out only if meritorious reactions are suspected?
What do you think, or know about the Buddhas view on such?
(Note that this has been not asked for trade, stacks, exchange or entertainment that binds here in this world, but as means of release)

What you mean by if meritorious reactions are suspected

On touch one might probably act kusala. If a wise approaches un-faithful devoted worldlings, akusala, such as upvoting this question, just for example, might be performed by fools, so causing them much demerits. If no touch, they might not conduct such, at least not being touched by good. That is the meaning, Upasaka @follower.

The general Buddhist advise is to associate wise people. There are many Buddhist stories that Buddha encountering unwise people. It appears that Buddha did not have much time for those people. You find stories such as Angulimala. But they appeared to be intelligent people.

Does Upasaka think that such answeres the question? (It was not about association, btw., althout that is of course right) Do wise leave their good association, to get (in) touch with unwise, even fools, risking that they make again some demerits?

Yes. Wise person would avoid situations which can give negative vibrations.
When you are in contact with negative things, they weaken you.
So as much as possible, you should be with positive thinkers.
Because, after all, our life is result of our sankalps, therefore, be with the things which give you hope and confidence.

With wise he was meant someone who would be no more shaken by the worldily dhammas, householder Manak.

Would a wise person go out only if meritorious reactions are suspected?
The Gilana Sutta (AN 3.22) might imply that a wise person would go out if a meritorious reaction is even possible -- even if an unmeritorious reaction were also possible -- i.e. "on the chance that they may actually turn out to need and benefit from such".
Another way to say it is, perhaps you shouldn't only judge an act by its effect -- "was it effective, successful?" -- but by intent.

Sadhu and: never on assumed effect, sticking to precepts fist till own intention has been learned to trace rightly. And it is because there is this sort of person that the other sorts of persons are to be taught the Dhamma as well [on the chance that they may actually turn out to need and benefit from the teaching].


text:
Difference between "mythology" and historical "facts"?
In this video, a monk tried to draw a distinction between "mythology" and "history facts" ...
Ajahn Sujato - Buddhist Mythology - The Sacred and the Profane - Part 3
... saying that "Mythology" just has a community (identification) purpose.
Yet my person's thought was, "and how is that different to 'factual' history (aside that it faster changes)?"
How can "mythology" (Anussava), and "history" (perhaps thought as Itivea?), be seriously distinguished, if possible? And how should the past be seen, grasped, in accordance with the path, practice?
What kind of mythology, history, and anussati (bringing into present) is conductive for one's way, toward long-time happiness and beyond?
(Note that this is not asked for trade, stacks, exchange or entertainment, but for good undertakings toward release from this wheel)

All we can know to be "facts" is the following:

Svākkhāto bhagavatā dhammo sandiṭṭhiko akāliko ehipassiko opaneyyiko
  paccattaṃ veditabbo viññūhī
The teaching (of Suffering Ending Truth) well explained by the Buddha — visible in the here-&-now, immediately effective, inviting inspection, leading onwards (to Nibbana), that
  sensible people can know for themselves.

This is the Dhamma Refuge taught by the Honest Awakened One (The Buddha); adhered to by Honest Noble People. This is all we can know as "fact" and this is all the Buddha expects or asks of us to know.

Yet my person's thought was "and how is that different to 'factual' history" (aside that it faster changes).
Yes perhaps you're right, if you're saying that "history" isn't much better than mythology.
Even so-called "history" is often (or, invariably?) partisan -- see e.g. Is history always written by the victors?
I am not an experienced (e.g. professional) historian, though -- so I don't want to say they are the same, either -- perhaps a historian might try to explain a distinction. I think that a very simple definition of "history" is that it's related to "writing" -- if nothing written survives, from a given period, then that period is by definition "prehistoric" -- though there may be something recorded from "oral history", or inferred from "archaeology" (and/or perhaps from "myth").
How can "mythology" and "history" be possible serious distinguished
I guess that's two questions:

How do professional historians distinguish?
How should a practising Buddhist distinguish?

Leaving aside the first as off-topic, I think there are suttas -- e.g. one of the suttas to Rahula, and the Kalama sutta -- where the Buddhas says people should consider what they themselves know to be true.
In my experience even what I "know" of my own personal history is not much better than any other history -- e.g. perhaps conceited, partisan, incomplete, and empty -- but even so perhaps people learn from experience (possibly learning wisdom or the opposite of ignorance), as Rahula was told to:

Having done a [...] action, you should reflect on it: 'This mental action I have done — did it lead to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both? Was it an unskillful mental action, with painful consequences, painful results?' If, on reflection, you know that it led to self-affliction, to the affliction of others, or to both; it was an unskillful mental action with painful consequences, painful results, then you should feel distressed, ashamed, & disgusted with it. Feeling distressed, ashamed, & disgusted with it, you should exercise restraint in the future. But if on reflection you know that it did not lead to affliction... it was a skillful mental action with pleasant consequences, pleasant results, then you should stay mentally refreshed & joyful, training day & night in skillful mental qualities.

I suppose Buddhists study the buddha-vacana too -- and maybe hagiographies (of which the Theragatha are an example).
What kind of mythology, history, anussati (bringing into present) is conductive for ones way toward long time happiness and beyond?
I'm not sure that story of the life of the Buddha, for example, is "history" -- including his birth and meeting the four "divine messengers".
Bhikkhu Bodhi wrote,

Meeting the Divine Messengers
The traditional legend of the Buddha's quest for enlightenment tells us that throughout his youth and early manhood Prince Siddhattha, the Bodhisatta, lived in complete ignorance of the most elementary facts of human life. His father, anxious to protect his sensitive son from exposure to suffering, kept him an unwitting captive of nescience. Incarcerated in the splendor of his palace, amply supplied with sensual pleasures and surrounded by merry friends, the prince did not entertain even the faintest suspicion that life could offer anything other than an endless succession of amusements and festivities. It was only on that fateful day in his twenty-ninth year, when curiosity led him out beyond the palace walls, that he encountered the four "divine messengers" that were to change his destiny. The first three were the old man, the sick man, and the corpse, which taught him the shocking truths of old age, illness, and death; the fourth was a wandering ascetic, who revealed to him the existence of a path whereby all suffering can be fully transcended.
This charming story, which has nurtured the faith of Buddhists through the centuries, enshrines at its heart a profound psychological truth. In the language of myth it speaks to us ...

When I visited Singapore once, for example, there were three books in the hotel room: a Christian Bible, an Islamic Koran, and a Buddhist "Life of the Buddha" of some kind.
I think that sort of "narrative" of the Buddha's life is well-known.
Perhaps -- I don't know -- it is everyone's first introduction to Buddhism: a story you learn as a child.

Thoughtful and careful share of thought, Nyom Chris.

How can "mythology" (Anussava), and "history" (perhaps thought as Itivea?), be seriously distinguished, if possible?
In my humble opinion, it cannot. History begins its transformation iinto mythology on its first retelling by a human. So, in a way, there is really no true history.
Even if we are present at an event, what we remember is modified by our life experiences and viewpoints. Many psychological studies on "eyewitness" recall have proved that. So what we recount to ourselves (and others) is always, in actuality, myth. The amount of myth-iness - or diversion from 'history' - in the retelling might vary but it will never be 0%. And the more retellings, the more divergence, as each individual in the chain modifies the story through their personal filters.
Even a film of an event seldom portrays straight 'history' - although I admit it can come close. The placement of the camera and the editing usually modify the perception of what was 'true' in the recording's retelling.
And how should the past be seen, grasped, in accordance with the path, practice?
Personally, I view that the past wisdom of the Buddha we have been provided, while myth by my definition, is definitely not without value. The actual words he used and perhaps some of the minor meanings may have been lost, but the essential core of his teachings have been shaped and interpreted by well meaning and intelligent fellow human beings through the centuries. What we may have lost in accurate 'history', we have gained in interpretations formed by the wisdom of 'the group'. His teachings have been, thus, amplified and refined for understanding through the humanity of each teacher in the chain.
What kind of mythology, history, and anussati (bringing into present) is conductive for one's way, toward long-time happiness and beyond?
In my opinion, all of the available texts and teachers are potentially valuable resources for us to find our way on the path to enlightenment. Since each interpretation has come to us through different chains, there will be some variability in the form of the knowledge. But by studying several and trying to be open to the teachings in each, we can build a composite understanding that will resonate with us and we will be able to incorporate into our being. Because it will, then, be totally accepted by us, we can be one with the methods and understand necessary work we individually need to use to attain our ultimate goal.
I believe this is consistent with the (mythical?) teaching we have received from the Buddha in the Kalama Sutta that we should not automatically accept any one single teaching / teacher as the absolute font of truth. By studying many, we will have a basis for determining which is our true path.


text:
Non duality - does it quash ambition?
If you have fully  '" arrived" at non duality is there a threat that you won't have ambition? Isn't ambition a driving force in human life ?

Good question. There are several schools of thought here.
According to one, attainment of nonduality does leave the person with nothing else to be done. No goals, no ambitions.
What follows from this is an idea that before a student is introduced to nonduality, they must be first taught discipline and a high-drive attitude, so by the time they attain non-duality, they develop a habit of being strong. A kind of prophylactics against the nondual depression, we could say.
According to another school, even though there is a clear realization that in nonduality no goals make absolute sense, relatively speaking some things are still locally "better" than others, so some local goals may still make relative sense. In this context, if someone has eyes to see local problems, they will remain motivated even if globally nothing makes sense.
Finally, according to my teacher, having goals post-enlightenment is more like playing Make-Believe. One doesn't actually buy into these things, so it's not like a true (blind) ambition. But an enlightened being may act as if they were seriously engaged with something, more for the sake of others, and even for an enlightened kind of "fun", than out of greed to achieve anything.
In (Mahayana) Buddhism, they define Enlightenment as "union of wisdom and compassion" for this very reason. Wisdom refers to realization of emptiness or nonduality, which sees that both suffering and so-called sentient beings are empty. Compassion is seeing that, however empty, the experience of suffering is rather painful -- hence the drive (=ambition?) to help out.

liked "blind ambition"

Ambition is a concept that can only be understood from the perspective of duality. Consider this:
From the dualistic perspective there is a human. The human desires to obtain an object. We call the strong desire for something and the striving to obtain it, ambition.
From the non-dual perspective, there is no human or object. Both were never separate, and the belief in their separateness was ignorance.
If there is no human, who is ambitious? If there is no object, what is there to be ambitious about?
The bottom line is this, non-duality is the perspective of non-separateness. Not many things becoming one, but the realization that there was never multiple things to begin with. Anything you can conceptualize as “separate” will be no longer considered so, and there will be no place for it.
It is not as if ambition will end. What you call ambition now will still remain. You will just understand that what you call ambition is no different from what you call the sky.
I hope this was helpful. I pray for nothing more than your liberation this lifetime.

When there is no more touch (phassa), the holy life is fullfilled, nothing further for this world.
One should be careful not to mistake householder-equanimity with it!

"Just as if a skilled butcher or butcher's apprentice, having killed a cow, were to carve it up with a sharp carving knife so that — without damaging the substance of the inner flesh, without damaging the substance of the outer hide — he would cut, sever, & detach only the skin muscles, connective tissues, & attachments in between. Having cut, severed, & detached the outer skin, and then covering the cow again with that very skin, if he were to say that the cow was joined to the skin just as it had been: would he be speaking rightly?"...Nandakovada Sutta: Nandaka's Exhortation.

It's wise if having the right ambition in life to overcome suffering and be really compassionate.
It's follish to seek and use means to be unaware able to increase the cemeteries in this world.
(Note that it has not been given for trade, exchange, stacks or entertainment but to use it skillful as means out of this wheel)

what is the point of speculating about permanently arriving at non-duality?  that which you believe to be dual, the second, is no longer present anyway.  so what are you worried about?  yes, i suppose ambition is needed for survival to some extent, but by the time you have "arrived" what does that even matter?  the real question might be, does ambition help or hinder achieving this impossible non-duality?  that's like asking does following the eightfold path help or hinder?  what assists, and what prevents?  perhaps non-duality is a random event that has no forbearance.

this answer is lacking a clear definition of duality/non-duality therefore i would re-answer or delete


text:
Is sky burial ritual inhumane and if not what is the reason for doing it?
When it seems inhumane, why is it practiced?
I know Buddha didn't find.
Wikipedia document says:

Sky burial (Tibetan: བྱ་གཏོར་, Wylie: bya   gtor, lit. "bird-scattered" is a funeral practice in.  which a human corpse is placed on a.   mountaintop to decompose while exposed to.  the elements or to be eaten by scavenging.  animals, especially carrion birds.

So are people still doing this kind of funeral practice?
And what is meaning of it?
Though the body is decomposed and exposed to the elements, this isn't seem a respectful way to do.

@ChrisW Thank you.

Upasaka Swapnil, interested,
It's a still practiced way in the high cold mountains, with also practical aspects, since such as fire-wood for burning is raw and soil might be frozen. Next to that it serves good for Asubha-meditation for yogies and monks.
Nothing generally wrong with such and not inhuman but not beloved by those attached to body as the Self and Subha.
Good to watch for everyone to get more detached to rupa: Sky Burial: Tibetan Burial Ritual (video on YouTube)
(Note that it has not been given for trade, exchange, stacks or entertainment but to use it skillful as means out of this wheel)

Thank you so much Bhante.  I got that this is the way to restrain from desire.

And is it practiced only in vajrayana tradition?

The introduction to the video suggests there's another purpose/reason: Sky Burial follows the ritual of "jha-tor", the giving of alms to birds in a northern Tibetan monastery - where the bodies of the dead are offered to the vultures as a final act of kindness to living beings.

Yes, Upasaka Swapnil, although donating one body to monks was also usual in Theravada, for asubha meditation.

Nyom Chris, yes, that is the deaths and the relatives thought as a "final" giving of Dana. Such kind of value less abounding was usual in all traditions, mostly to what ever animals, worms...

Thanks a lot Bhante. Is it same as organ donation? So is it their own decision to offer own body to birds?

I must be thankful to my friend who has sent me a video of this ritual. So may he is thinking something weird is happening, had asked me if it is real.  I will explain him what is it.  Thank you so much again.

I was fortunate to have visited Lhasa last fall and discuss some with folks there. It is still very much practiced, although, like other similar religious practices, discouraged by the Chinese. I was told it is typically a unanimous family decision.


text:
I feel uncomfortable about jury duty
I have been asked to do jury duty. As I follow a Buddhist philosophy of Ahimsa, no-harm, I feel conflicted. If I vote guilty, and the defendant is not, I would feel guilty myself. If he/she is guilty, and I vote to acquit, likewise I would feel guilty. So I will be asked to be excused on religious grounds. Is this a valid reason for me to be excused?
Thank you,
Thomas Ramsay.

In which country?

You're judging their guilt or innocence, not punishing them or deciding their fate, so I don't see a serious problem. Jury duty seems fine. Not so sure about the judge. The Sufi's say 'To make a man a judge is to kill him without a knife'.  .

Regardless of the person's guilt if give a verdict the karmic result will follow.
Beaing a ruler, judge or juror from a karmic stand point is not advisable.
Temiya Jataka would be of interest where a price tried hard not to be king as this would mean you have to judge others and even be at war.
So getting excused would be a good option.

So this would mean as a lay person you would go through life without making any judgements, what if you're a hiring manager and choosing one person over the other meant the one wouldn't be able to support his family because you didn't give him a job? Would there be a karmic consequence of that as well?

Every volition backed action has an karmic concequance. Also in life you cannot totally having to take action in every situation. It all boils down to what your level of resolve is to not making decremental karmic actions. In the case of Prince Temiya it was a very High bar.

I see no reason why a good decision by a juror should not have positive karmic consequences, and where it is a selfless one it may have no consequences. The alternative would be scrap juries, and this does not seem like a good idea.

Just follow the laws that are there. If you are unsure about guilt or innocence say so. Even monks and nuns stand in judgement over one another when they commit an offense and there is a consequence for it. If you find the person broke law but are uncomfortable with the consequences i.e., sentence, ask to be excused. But even senior monks have a responsibility to judge monks who broke the rules and generally speaking citizens have the same responsibility.

Thank you for your insightful comments.

This question is unrelated to Buddhism but related to the laws of your land.
I recommend to write to the Court Clerk exactly what you wrote here. They will probably regard you as unfit or too sensitive for jury duty.

I feel conflicted. If I vote guilty, and the defendant is not, i would
  feel guilty myself. If he/she is guilty, and I vote to acquit,
  likewise i would feel guilty

If you wish to sound more freaky, include the following:

49. As a bee gathers honey from the flower without injuring its color or fragrance, even so the sage goes on his alms-round in the village.
50. Let none find fault with others; let none see the omissions and commissions of others. But let one see one's own acts, done and
  undone.
Dhammapada

Monks, even if bandits were to carve you up savagely, limb by limb, with a two-handled saw, he among you who let his heart get angered
  even at that would not be doing my bidding. Even then you should train
  yourselves: 'Our minds will be unaffected and we will say no evil
  words. We will remain sympathetic, with a mind of good will, and with
  no inner hate. We will keep pervading these people with an awareness
  imbued with good will and, beginning with them, we will keep pervading
  the all-encompassing world with an awareness imbued with good will —
  abundant, expansive, immeasurable, free from hostility, free from ill
  will.' That's how you should train yourselves.
Kakacupama Sutta: The Simile of the Saw

Who knows the difference between them except a Realized One?
So, Ānanda, don’t be judgmental about people. Don’t pass judgment on people. Those who pass judgment on people harm themselves.
I (The Buddha), or someone like me, may pass judgment on people.
AN 6.44

That's a good question.  As a JD, I would tell you that the purpose of a jury is for America to live up to its promise of a fair trial, so no one should technically be obligated to sit on the jury, if they choose not to.  Citing religious grounds is legally fair.
As a Buddhist, I'd say participate to learn about your own legal system, without which you may harm another as well.  But inform them that your religion does not allow you to convict another and so will not vote.

yes it is not easy to deal with all the moronic rules invented by puthujjanas. Generally those puthujjanas hate that people do not follow their rules, they will claim that the only way that your refusal will comply with their ways is to follow the various punishments applied when they think there is an infringement to their rules.
You can try to see what punishment they have prepared when you do not follow what they call ''jury duty'' and if you think you can handle it, by being mindful as usual like when you are bullied and hurt https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.143.than.html , just take their ways. this way you refusal will comply to their rules and those puthujjanas will say that the suffering they inflicted upon you paid for the offense you caused them by not doing what they want you to do. [puthujjanas love to make people suffer when they think people do not follow their rules]
if you still are on the jury try to follow their rules as much as you can while never lying. Be honest that you do not know if the person is guilty of infringement or not.
You can ask them ''why does it matter if this person is guilty of infringement or not'? what is the point of judging this person? what is achieved by punishing this person if this person you found this person guilty of infringing you rules?'' but puthujjanas hate to question their ways, especially the judges, policemen and lawmakers, since they already think they are righteous, so be careful with that.
here is the story of a ''tibetan buddhist'' about his jury duty https://tricycle.org/magazine/called-jury-duty/
There is a good comment here too https://www.reddit.com/r/Buddhism/comments/4yluel/jury_duty/

Be honest with them during the selection process about your
  reservations and how your beliefs might influence your decision in a
  case. Your admitted hesitance in even convicting someone you believe
  is guilty is, at the very least, something they deserve to know. The
  fact that your religious convictions come before "justice" could very
  well disqualify you anyway.

The contempt you have for puthujjanas must be difficult for you. I'd rather you didn't express it on a Buddhist forum in case visitors conclude Buddhist generally have this attitude. . .

Thank you for this wisdom. I dont have contempt for anyone, as I try to be mindful that each has a right to his/her own view. I have expressed my view on this situation.


text:
Non duality - must it be transcendent
I am exploring non duality. I tend to believe it's true but I'm not sure if I accept the transcendent element. Is it possible that this awareness is simply a deeper level of the mind ? That it's not part of God or a higher power. Not eternal?

From AN10.29:

Someone perceives the meditation on universal earth above, below, across, non-dual and limitless.
  They perceive the meditation on universal water …
  the meditation on universal fire …
  the meditation on universal air …
  the meditation on universal blue …
  the meditation on universal yellow …
  the meditation on universal red …
  the meditation on universal white …
  the meditation on universal space …
  They perceive the meditation on universal consciousness above, below, across, non-dual and limitless.
  These are the ten universal dimensions of meditation.
  The best of these ten universal dimensions of meditation is when someone perceives the meditation on universal consciousness above, below, across, non-dual and limitless.
  Some sentient beings perceive like this.
  But even the sentient beings who perceive like this decay and perish.

Yes. It is not eternal.
The sutta ends with the Buddha declaring:

But I do advocate the complete understanding of sensual pleasures, sights, and feelings. And I advocate complete extinguishment by not grasping in this very life, wishless, extinguished, and cooled.”

Regarding transcendance and theories of a self, SN12.2 may be of interest:

There are these four kinds of grasping.
  Grasping at sensual pleasures, views, precepts and observances, and theories of a self.

But is there a belief that once your dead the awareness transcends you ? After death. Pre birth

Thank you. Added Buddha's answer regarding theories of a self

It’s not transcendent, it’s immanent.  It doesn’t happen beyond or above the realm of form but rather happens within it.  There’s nothing divine about it.  It just is and goes on unnoticed.  In a sense, non dualism is a bogus and misleading concept.  Non duality is only significant because our conventional understanding is marked by dualism.  We don’t go about our day spinning philosophical missives about dualism because that’s our mundane reality.  Non dualism is equally mundane.  You don’t have non dualism, non dualism isn’t a state of mind, non dualism isn’t God.  Non dualism is simply what’s left when duality is undermined.