<p>EDITED as suggested by WMXZ</p>
<p><strong>SHORT ANSWER</strong></p>
<p>Yes, by default the PAMGuard database will be mostly empty when processing/analysing data from a SoundTrap. This is the intended behaviour, so should not really be characterised as a 'problem.' The processed results  from click detector, whistle and moan detector, and LTSA will instead be stored in the binary files, and these can be reviewed in PAMGuard Viewer Mode and can be analysed outside PAMGuard using additional software.</p>
<p>Since it's not clear to me what was being sought from the the database, here are some related links on StackExchange describing some of the downstream/post-PAMGuard analyses that others have been attempting:</p>
<ul>
<li><a href="https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/87/how-to-extract-the-timing-and-received-level-of-spectrogram-annotations-manually">How to extract the timing and received level of spectrogram annotations manually marked in PAMguard?</a></li>
<li><a href="https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/1429/extracting-click-trains-from-the-click-train-module-in-r">Extracting Click trains (from the click train module) in R</a></li>
<li><a href="https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/999/date-ticked-ltsa-using-pamguard-binaries-from-duty-cycled-soundtrap-data/1064#1064">Date ticked LTSA using PAMGuard binaries from duty cycled soundtrap data</a></li>
</ul>
<p><strong>BACKGROUND</strong></p>
<p>PAMGuard provides several different ways to store data including in the database, as PAMGuard specific PAMBinary files, and/or as wav files. Metadata can be stored in these three places, as well as in PAMGuard settings files (.psfx)</p>
<p>Where the data are stored depends on the module. Some modules, like the GPS, Logger Forms, and User Input, store data only in the database. Other modules (e.g. LTSA) only create PAMBinary files. And of course some modules, like the Click Detector and Whistle and Moan Detector and Noise Band Monitor can store data in both the database and PAMBinary files.</p>
<p>Storage location of data for each module can be viewed and controlled from:</p>
<p>File-&gt;Storage Options..</p>
<p>For example, here's a screenshot of my typical Storage Options for an overview of data from my SoundTrap:
<a href="https://i.sstatic.net/FLKOu.png" rel="nofollow noreferrer"><img src="https://i.sstatic.net/FLKOu.png" alt="PAMGuard Storage Options" /></a></p>
<p>If a check box is grayed out, then that storage option is not supported by the module. Most (maybe all) modules that support both options tend to have a default setting of Binary Store (PAMBinary). In general the PAMBinaries offer more flexibility than the database, and so tend to be preferable for acoustic data, where the length/size/data volume can vary for each item.</p>
<p>There is an option in Viewer mode that can copy data from PAMBinaries to the database, but I'm not sure how well supported this option is. I wouldn't recommend using it, and in the past when I've tried it, it's been just as likely to destroy my data as produce the desired result. So if you do go this route, you probably want to make sure you've backed everything up. Also, for items that can use both types of storage, the corresponding database entry for such an item will be a simple summary, i.e. somewhat incomplete compared to the PAMBinary version.</p>
<p>So, instead of using both PAMBinaries and database for a module, a better option would be to keep the default (PAMBinary) storage option, and then to make use of the Matlab and R libraries for downstream/post-processing of PAMGuard data (see: <a href="https://www.pamguard.org/48_MATLABRcode.html" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://www.pamguard.org/48_MATLABRcode.html</a> and other posts in Bioacoustics Stack Exchange for more on this option).</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-02-05T06:47:00.063Z
Brian, may I suggest to expand the bottom part to answer more concrete the OP question (even if it describes, at least for me, the situation not well)?
WMXZ
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-02-06T00:58:48.467Z
Thanks, good suggestion. I've reworked my answer to more clearly address the OP up front. I have left my original answer, but moved this down as it is more background info.
Brian Miller
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-02-05T01:05:39.320Z
2024-02-06T00:54:26.800Z
2024-02-06T00:54:26.800Z
Brian Miller
<p>I just finished processing an acoustic dataset from SoundTraps, and when I opened the SQLite database that I created, it appears blank for my Whistle and Moan detector, LTSA and Noise Band Monitor. However, I can see that the processing generated many folders in the binary dataset. I followed the PAMGuard tutorial designed for SoundTraps and could not find how to fix the problem. I would really appreciate if you could give me any suggestions.</p>

<soundtrap><data-storage><data-processing>
My data is not being stored in the SQLite database
# My data is not being stored in the SQLite database

(Asked by: username_0 on 2024-02-02)

I just finished processing an acoustic dataset from SoundTraps, and when I opened the SQLite database that I created, it appears blank for my Whistle and Moan detector, LTSA and Noise Band Monitor. However, I can see that the processing generated many folders in the binary dataset. I followed the PAMGuard tutorial designed for SoundTraps and could not find how to fix the problem. I would really appreciate if you could give me any suggestions.

**Tags:** soundtrap, data-storage, data-processing


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## 1 answers

### Answer by username_1 on 2024-02-05. Score: 3

EDITED as suggested by username_2

**SHORT ANSWER**

Yes, by default the PAMGuard database will be mostly empty when processing/analysing data from a SoundTrap. This is the intended behaviour, so should not really be characterised as a 'problem.' The processed results from click detector, whistle and moan detector, and LTSA will instead be stored in the binary files, and these can be reviewed in PAMGuard Viewer Mode and can be analysed outside PAMGuard using additional software.

Since it's not clear to me what was being sought from the the database, here are some related links on StackExchange describing some of the downstream/post-PAMGuard analyses that others have been attempting:

* [How to extract the timing and received level of spectrogram annotations manually marked in PAMguard?](https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/87/how-to-extract-the-timing-and-received-level-of-spectrogram-annotations-manually)
* [Extracting Click trains (from the click train module) in R](https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/1429/extracting-click-trains-from-the-click-train-module-in-r)
* [Date ticked LTSA using PAMGuard binaries from duty cycled soundtrap data](https://bioacoustics.stackexchange.com/questions/999/date-ticked-ltsa-using-pamguard-binaries-from-duty-cycled-soundtrap-data/1064#1064)

**BACKGROUND**

PAMGuard provides several different ways to store data including in the database, as PAMGuard specific PAMBinary files, and/or as wav files. Metadata can be stored in these three places, as well as in PAMGuard settings files (.psfx)

Where the data are stored depends on the module. Some modules, like the GPS, Logger Forms, and User Input, store data only in the database. Other modules (e.g. LTSA) only create PAMBinary files. And of course some modules, like the Click Detector and Whistle and Moan Detector and Noise Band Monitor can store data in both the database and PAMBinary files.

Storage location of data for each module can be viewed and controlled from:

File->Storage Options..

For example, here's a screenshot of my typical Storage Options for an overview of data from my SoundTrap:
[![PAMGuard Storage Options](https://i.sstatic.net/FLKOu.png)](https://i.sstatic.net/FLKOu.png)

If a check box is grayed out, then that storage option is not supported by the module. Most (maybe all) modules that support both options tend to have a default setting of Binary Store (PAMBinary). In general the PAMBinaries offer more flexibility than the database, and so tend to be preferable for acoustic data, where the length/size/data volume can vary for each item.

There is an option in Viewer mode that can copy data from PAMBinaries to the database, but I'm not sure how well supported this option is. I wouldn't recommend using it, and in the past when I've tried it, it's been just as likely to destroy my data as produce the desired result. So if you do go this route, you probably want to make sure you've backed everything up. Also, for items that can use both types of storage, the corresponding database entry for such an item will be a simple summary, i.e. somewhat incomplete compared to the PAMBinary version.

So, instead of using both PAMBinaries and database for a module, a better option would be to keep the default (PAMBinary) storage option, and then to make use of the Matlab and R libraries for downstream/post-processing of PAMGuard data (see: <https://www.pamguard.org/48_MATLABRcode.html> and other posts in Bioacoustics Stack Exchange for more on this option).

> **Comments:**
> **username_2**: username_1, may I suggest to expand the bottom part to answer more concrete the OP question (even if it describes, at least for me, the situation not well)?  
> **username_1**: Thanks, good suggestion. I've reworked my answer to more clearly address the OP up front. I have left my original answer, but moved this down as it is more background info.  

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